Discuss n's answer to: Best Religion

Dear Friends;

Here is a snippet of what many Christians think, and how those who believe inG-d can help.

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[Pastor John Hagee is the head of Christians United for Israel (CUFI) - an American pro-Israel Christian organization that defines itself as "a national grassroots movement focused on the support of Israel." It is the largest Christian pro-Israel organization in the United States.]

Dear Pastor Hagee and Christians Zionists,

Thank you for the work that you are doing. Christians supporting Israel is a beautiful phenomenon and it is beginning to heal the many wounds that Jews suffered at the hands of persecutors in the name of the Church for almost two-millennia. It is amazing to see Christians singing Israeli songs in beautiful harmony, waving the flag of Israel along with the flag of the USA, and even donating their hard-earned money to many causes of Israel. It is a sight that past generations could not have imagined, and it is a blessing for Israel and a blessing for Christians as well.

To be sure, there is still lingering suspicion between our two worlds. Among the Jews, there are many who doubt the sincerity of Christians with regard to Israel. Jewish skepticism is understandable since the dark past is still fresh while some Christian circles continue to practice underhanded missionizing tactics against Jews and maintain a goal of infiltrating Israel. These keep many Jews from believing that there are Christians who truly love Israel without ulterior motives.

For its side, the Christian world is certainly not homogeneous. While Israel-lovers make their voices heard, Israel-haters, like those who recently organized the “Christ at the Checkpoint Conference” in Bethlehem seek to undermine Israel’s sovereignty. These Christians do not see the ingathering of the Jews to the land of Israel as a fulfillment of prophecy but rather an obstacle to their theological supremacy. For them, replacement theology is alive and well, with Christianity attempting to best Judaism and Palestine aiming to replace Israel.

This is why true Christian Zionism is so important: it gives a platform for Bible-believing pro-Israel Christians to show their real love for Israel, to heal the painful past, and to offset the forces that want to use Christianity to bring Israel down.

However, if Christian Zionism to is win the ideological war against replacement theology, and earn Jewish trust, Christian Zionism needs to take a stand on real issues. Standing with Israel means backing Israel when we face our enemies. Today, those enemies use, more and more, the tool of delegitimization to remove the underpinnings of the Jewish State. Shockingly, some of the US Government’s own policies lend a hand to the delegitimization campaign, and it is in this arena where Israel-loving American citizens in general, and American Christian Zionists in particular, can make a difference.

Here is one example among many:

When I speak with American Christian groups I ask: “Do you know that the US is the number-one de-legitimizer of Jewish sovereignty in Jerusalem?”

People are invariably shocked when I explain that the US refuses to place its embassy in Jerusalem because it does not recognize Jerusalem as part of Israel, let alone the capital of Israel. The State Department does not even add the word “Israel” to the word “Jerusalem” in any official document including birth certificates, passports, and death certificates, so that children born in Jerusalem (like my daughter) have no “country of birth” listed in their American papers.

As Ambassador Yoram Ettinger has written: “Israel is the only country in the world, whose (3,000 year old) capital is not recognized by the State Department and by the Presidents of the US. However 71% [of the American people] support (and 9% oppose) Jerusalem as Israel’s indivisible capital.”

I also remind American Christians that it is not only about paper work. US government representatives make a point to tell Israel not to build in Jerusalem. This was the case in August 2010 when Vice President Biden slammed Israel for planning to build additional housing in a well established residential neighborhood in the capital.

This State Department position sends a signal to the world that if America, Israel’s friend, rejects the legitimacy of Jewish Jerusalem, certainly the Irans of this world have a right to challenge it as well.

But the American people did not accept this toxic status quo. They fought and passed a new law in Congress entitled the Jerusalem Embassy Act of 1995 which calls for the embassy to be moved from Tel Aviv to Jerusalem no later than May 31, 1999. The law also said that “Jerusalem should remain an undivided city…[and that] Jerusalem should be recognized as the capital of the State of Israel.”

But this act has a proviso which allows the president to waive the law every 6 months. And, sadly, Presidents Clinton, Bush, and Obama, have not missed an opportunity to deny the American people the fulfillment of the law which reflects their will and has been passed by their representatives. In fact, President Obama just signed the waiver again, and regarding Mitt Romney, JTA writes: “the Republican presidential candidate, has privately told Jewish leaders he would not commit to moving the embassy as president.” So the US embassy is still in Tel Aviv, and my daughter’s US passport is still countryless.

At this point of the talk, members of the American Christian group I am addressing are really mad and they want to know only one thing: “How do we engage? Our own government delegitimizes Jewish rights to Jerusalem and thereby delegitimizes the State of Israel! How do we combat our government which is taking our money to curtail policies we voted for, and fulfill policies that we abhor?”

And that is the beauty of American civil society – being suspicious of power in the hands of government and keeping that power in check is hardwired into the American system, and into the American psyche. As the long history of American politics and jurisprudence shows: US government policy can actually be changed by the people. They just need to be empowered.

With that in mind, I turn to you, Pastor Hagee.

At the top of your website one finds a quote from Isaiah: “For Zion’s sake I will not keep silent, And for Jerusalem’s sake I will not keep quiet.” This begs the question: where is CUFI and the Christian Zionist community on the Jerusalem issue? Where is the American people’s voice, and especially the Christian voice, saying “Hey, US Government, fulfill your mandate, end the waiver charade, and follow the law. The American people want the US to recognize Jerusalem as the unified capital of Israel now!”

Pastor Hagee, I once heard you say at a fundraiser in Jerusalem: “Don’t tell me you love me, show me you love me.” Now I say that very phrase back to you – Don’t tell me you love me, show me you love me by harnessing the power of CUFI and Christian Zionists to defend Jerusalem from bad US policy. American Christian Zionists are in a unique position to be part of the struggle against Israel’s delegitimization and they are waiting for you to empower them and If CUFI gets behind the issue, you can be sure the White House will listen.

A success in this arena will be a historical achievement for CUFI and for American Christian Zionism, and it will go a long way to building bridges and healing age-old wounds. In short, this is your fight.

With Sincere Respect,

Yishai

[Editors note: The movement for US recognition of Jerusalem as the capital of Israel is beginning to take root in the Christian world. On June 6, 2012, the International Israel Allies Caucus Foundation together with members of the Congressional Israel Allies Caucus held the second annual Jerusalem Day Prayer Breakfast hosted Jewish and Christian leaders, addressing the importance of Jerusalem as the eternal, undivided capital of the Jewish people.

Members of the Congressional Israel Allies Caucus and co-chairs Rep. Trent Franks (AZ-02) and Rep. Doug Lamborn (CO-05) spoke together with Rep. Michelle Bachman, Rep. Louie Gohmert, Rep. Allen West, Rep. Joe Walsh, Rep. Randy Hultgren, and Rep. John Flemming along with his wife Cindy Flemming. They declared support for a united Jerusalem and the legislation that is currently in the House and Senate to recognize Jerusalem as the capital of Israel and move the US Embassy from Tel Aviv to Jerusalem.<<<

Thank you all.

Shalom;

Yechiel

John Hagee is a false prophet, working for the New World Order gang. Hagee teaches a heresy known as "Zionism." Religious Zionism teaches that God has a separate covenant with Israel and another for the Gentile Church. This is unbiblical and is sometimes called a "Dual Covenant." Hagee stated to the Houston Chronicle that he believes Jews have a special covenant with God and do not need to come to the cross for salvation. According to Hagee Jews don't need to be born-again.

John Hagee's Heresy

Beware!

http://www.jesus-is-savior.com/False%20Doctrines/john_hagees_heresy.htm

Whoever transgresses and does not abide in the doctrine of Christ does not have God. (2 John 9a)

Furthermore, instead of contending for the faith, the doctrine of Christ, the word of God (Genesis 1:1-31; Exodus 20:11; and 31:17 are part of the faith), Hagee encourages doctrinal lewdness (Jude 4) by saying,

    Since Christians hold various views, it is important to keep an attitude of humility and charity toward others in these complicated areas.

First of all, it is not complicated.  Hagee makes that which is simple into a complicated matter. Why? Because he doesn't believe the Bible. Matters can become quite complicated when the Bible is not believed. Hagee does not abide in the doctrine of Christ, the teaching of the Word.

Secondly, Hagee encourages people away from Jude 3 (contend earnestly for the faith) and onto a damning ecumenical mentality, doctrinal lewdness (Jude 4), that encourages people to "not receive the love of the truth, that they might be saved" (2 Thessalonians 2:10). Thus, they will be damned, similar to those in 2 Thessalonians 2:10-12. By calling those who "hold various views" "Christians," Hagee calls for people to loosen the loins of their minds (contrary to 1 Peter 1:13), take off the belt of truth (Ephesians 6:14), and discard Christ, the Truth (John 14:6). Anyone who holds a view contrary to the word of God and does not consent (2 Timothy 2:24-26) to what the Bible teaches is proud, knows nothing, and is destitute of the truth (1 Timothy 6:3-5). Such a one is not a Christian, but is a liar (1 John 2:4). The "charity" that is in order for such a one is this: "From such withdraw yourself" (1 Timothy 6:5).

Hagee teaches no such thing here, because he does not abide in the doctrine of Christ (2 John 9).

Moreover, the matters above also reveal his trust is not in the Bible, but rather in what the "Christian" community is believing. Hagee says, "Christians hold various views" (on creation), "interpreters differ" (on the future), and "people come to different conclusions. It does not matter what so-called "Christians" hold to, or what "interpreters differ" on, or what "different conclusions" people come to.

What matters is, what does the Bible say. This is what true Christians believe (John 14:23-24). And in regards to John Hagee, and men like him, the Bible says,

    But there were also false prophets among the people, even as there will be false teachers among you, who will secretly bring in destructive heresies, even denying the Lord who bought them . . . (2 Peter 2:1)

John Hagee is a false teacher who denies the Lord who bought him, because John Hagee denies His word. He denies Genesis 1:1-31; Exodus 20:11; 31:17; Matthew 5:3; Philippians 2:3; 2 John 9; Jude 3; 1 Timothy 6:3-5; Revelation 20; etc.. Anyone who denies God's Word, denies Jesus Christ, because Jesus is the Word (John 1:1), the very word of God (Hebrews 4:12-13; Revelation 19:13).

John Hagee’s view on the Jews. He teaches that they are saved without faith in Jesus. Hagee is a strong opponent of those who are anti-Semitic. The problem is his view of Antisemitism has led him to make a serious error in doctrine concerning salvation. He teaches that Jews are saved without conversion to Christianity. John Hagee believes that, “Trying to convert Jews is a waste of time.” He then goes on to state, “Everyone else, whether Buddhist or Baha’i, needs to beleive in Jesus but not Jews.” Hagee believes that, “Jews already have a covenant with God that has never been replaced with Christianity.” He continues to teach this by saying, “The Jewish people have a relationship to God through the law of God as given through Moses,” Hagee said. “I believe that every Gentile person can only come to God through the cross of Christ. I believe that every Jewish person who lives in the light of the Torah, which is the word of God, has a relationship with God and will come to redemption.“The law of Moses is sufficient enough to bring a person into the knowledge of God until God gives him a greater revelation. And God has not,”

Is this what the bible teaches about salvation? I think not. Romans 10:19-21 shows Paul teaching that Israel had the responsibility to respond to the Gospel, but instead they rejected it. Romans 9:6 tells us that not all who are of Israel are of Israel. Romans 9:27 says that the remnant will be saved. Romans 10:9-15 tells that we are saved when we confess Christ and that faith is only through Christ…there is no distinction between Jew and Greek, for the same Lord saves them all.

John Hagee is is like yechiel.. He takes scripture and wraps it around his own twisted theology and leaves many in complete confusion.

Dear Readers;

For those interested in truth, see this website on Hagee;

>>> http://www.apologeticsindex.org/357-john-hagee-salvation<<<

Thank you.

Shalom;

Yechiel

Read what the King James Bible, God's Word, has to say about Israel and the Jews...

    1st Kings 9:6-8, "But if ye shall at all turn from following me, ye or your children, and will not keep my commandments and my statutes which I have set before you, but go and serve other gods, and worship them: Then will I cut off Israel out of the land which I have given them; and this house, which I have hallowed for my name, will I cast out of my sight; and Israel shall be a proverb and a byword among all people: And at this house, which is high, every one that passeth by it shall be astonished, and shall hiss; and they shall say, Why hath the LORD done thus unto this land, and to this house?"

, John Hagee, says Jews are special and don't need to be born-again to go to Heaven.

Israel today is a whoring after OTHER gods. God has cut Israel off and cast the temple out of His sight, just as He warned. Israel today is a barren land of misery and tumbleweeds. Tourists to Israel wag their heads in disbelief. The Jews know it, which is why Jewish rabbis spit on Christians. .

BOTH Judaizer Jews and Islamic Arabs reject Jesus as the Messiah, the only begotten Son of God. Therefore, BOTH religions worship the same false mythical god that doesn't exist. Anyone who openly rejects Jesus Christ has also rejected the Father the Bible says. 1st John 2:23, “Whosoever denieth the Son, the same hath not the Father: (but) he that acknowledgeth the Son hath the Father also.” Most Jews today, including the official Judaism religion of the nation of Israel, REJECT Jesus as the Christ. Therefore Jews DO NOT have the Father either, just as Arabs who follow Muhammad DO NOT have the Father.

Thank you Jameslee, for your excellent response here. 

"Quote" "Truth is not in books or on web sites or even in the Bible"

Or even in the Bible?? The Holy Bible is Gods Word, Jesus is the Word of God. The truth is in Jesus Christ, the word Of God. 

I have God living in my body in the form of the Holy Spirit. Romans 8:9 tells us that the  Spirit of Christ dwells within every believer. I am not God, but I have God's Spirit living in my body. The Godhead indwells every believer. The Holy Spirit of God guides me, comforts me, teaches me, rebukes me, chastises me, convicts me, encourages me, empowers me, loves me, strengthens me, and so much more. The Holy Spirit uses the Word of God to do these things. This is why it is critically important for every believer to live in their Bible (and make sure you have a reliable Bible—I only use the King James).

A person cannot understand the Bible without the presence of the Author, and God is the Author. When you become born-again (or born for the second time), God's Holy Spirit comes into your body (1st Corinthians 3:16), never to leave (Hebrews 13:5), and you will understand many new things for the first time in your life...

"Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new." —2nd Corinthians 5:17

It is ONLY through the Precious Word of God that anyone can be born-again. Surely, no one can be born into this world again physically... there is no turning back the hands of time. However, you most certainly can be born again, spiritually, into God's family through the Spirit of Christ... "But ye are not in the flesh, but in the Spirit, if so be that the Spirit of God dwell in you. Now if any man have not the Spirit of Christ, he is none of his" (Romans 8:9). The way we become "born again" is found in the Word of God...

"Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever." —1st Peter 1:23

We are born again by the Word of God. Jesus is the Word of God (John 1:1,14: Revelation 19:13). The following statement sums it up pretty good...

If you're born once, then you die TWICE; If you're born twice, then you die ONCE.