Discuss jameslee102447's answer to: Best Religion

Attn: Yechiel

Are you absolutely brain dead that you cannot see or understand anything that I have said? It is not the belief that makes you antichrist. This is not theory, it is fact, and do you not even understand the definition of the word “antichrist?” It’s a simple word and has a simple definition. You can’t be that stupid, it is simple, it is not rather you believe in Jesus the Christ or not, but what has been repeatedly said, and you still circumvent. I will post it again but I cannot make it anymore simple, and I post it now for others to see just how out of touch you are with what you read. This is the third time and yet you still have not been able to comprehend it. You are antichrist “when you make comments regarding Jesus the Christ and the Virgin Birth as being untrue and with no validity.” and let me fellow up again with “You have continuously and openly opposed Jesus the Christ and the Virgin Birth as being untrue, and with a concentrated effort tried to prove it was untrue.” This is not concerning your personal beliefs, but your open and clear opposition as to rather Jesus the Christ and the Virgin Birth are true or not. You keep trying to disprove Jesus the Christ and the Virgin Birth and this is obviously antichrist.

As for your back door insult as having a persecution complex just shows how desperate you must be to defend the un-defendable. And yes “Being of a different opinion does not mean against; just a different way to see it.” You posted a truth and this is my point, and not my theory. I have never said or posted that I do not accept Torah or HaShem and never tried to convince anyone otherwise. My personal beliefs are my own but if I was active in posting against God I would be viewed and witnessed to as anti-God.

You stated that if I carried that view far enough we could not have a common ground, and this I also agree with, and this also is my point. You are carrying your view of Jesus the Christ and the Virgin Birth and posting them as being untrue, is this not that same common ground that you were speaking of?

While it is truth that there are Christians that do not agree, rather with me or other Christians is irrelevant and goes without saying, for is this not true with every faith? And there are no Christians that do not believe that Jesus the Christ is not divine. You are not a Christian without believing that Jesus the Christ is the Son of God.

And for verification let me say once again that it is not your views that makes you antichrist but your open defiance and opposition to something that makes you anti-?

When three people call you a jackass you might want to get yourself a saddle. Hummmmmmmmmmmmmmmm?

It’s better to be hated for what you are then loved for what you are not. Hummmmmmmmmm?

And there’s no need to call HaShem in the morning, I have a direct line to Him called Jesus the Christ.

Dear;

I have understood you perfectly. But I refuse to accept the (to me) Jack Ass description of "AntiChrist." I have been brought up in the Judaic tradition that G-d expect us to use our brains, not just follow a concept or person.

Judaism=Study and Learn.

Christianity = Follow by Faith.

Islam = Submit.

In study, I run across many who agree and disagree with me. Which do I prefer? If with common sense and respect, disagree, so I have even more of an opportunity to learn.

So as such, you Anti-Christ label is worthless for anyone who, as me, do not care what faith you claim, just do it. G-d, according to Him, shall bless you if you do.

You have G-d to go to, but as I understand you and most other Christians, you have Jesus between you and G-d. Fine, in the stage of development your culture is at, you may need all the help you can get.

In Judaism, we have G-d, directly. No hemming or hewing around, but I sin (make a mess), I repent (clean up the mess I make). Not even G-d does this for me.

You see, James, you have someone to make the amends for you; in Judaism, I am responsible for my mess, I clean up my mess. 

I have answered you as direct as I can, with what YOU gave me to understand. I have done so with respect, humor and as a fellow human being. You come across as not understanding this, with me and others, so maybe you need the saddle?

In all seriousness why do you argue? I have nothing against any faith; I am as far from an anti Christ as the dictionary allows, so can you settle down, and behave in a "Christian" way?

As for being hated for what I am, nothing new, and really, I do not care. I look at what is presented to me honestly, if it fits, I make the proper emends, if not, no skin off of my nose. I answer to G-d, and I have noticed that many over the years have taken exception to this, try to make up reasons why I am wrong. My response is to listen/read, and find what I can to improve myself as a human being.

Those in the real world, where I live and have a good life, I am told that I have and am doing well.

Some of your material has been read by friends; they wonder if you are serious, as I am told that you are not a good example of one who they would look to, to represent their faith.

Mike said as much to me, when he told me - MikeC says: 

"Yechiel I think you may just be the best Christian on "Best Religion". I can't believe what I am seeing. "

So you do not have that much room to move. I again remind you of your postings against me, when I posted what that Christian man from the Near East said; is that what Jesus would have done?

Shalom;

Yechiel

Attn: Yechiel

You have not understood me at all, you have only understood yourself. You are so full of yourself you cannot accept anything. Self centered and in denial of the obvious. And Judaism and Christianity are both followed by Faith and Discovery and understanding of the Word of God. Also Jesus the Christ is not between us and God but reconciles us with Him and in so doing we have all the help that we can get as you so blindly put it.

And while you are cleaning up your mess you might want to remember that the wages of sin is death. As for the Christian Faith, they have learned to recognize their sins and by accepting forgiveness through Jesus the Christ and repenting and seeking after righteousness they are justified freely by His grace and acquitted of all past guilt that allows us to have contact with God by believing in the redemption that is in Christ Jesus. And this becomes the responsibility of all who believe that Jesus the Christ is the Messiah, for only those that are guiltless can enter the presents of God.

And we are now back to how upright you are according to you, and how I don’t understand how upright you are according to you and others, you find need to imply that others support you in rather I think you are upright or not.

I argue regarding this issue because of your total denial of the obvious, the definition of the word antichrist is clear, what you have written in the past regarding Jesus the Christ and the Virgin Birth is clear. And yet you say “I am as far from an antichrist as the dictionary allows.” Not sure what that means but you are right on to what the dictionary definition of what antichrist means, there is no dispute, it could not be anymore clear. Stop speaking, writing against Jesus the Christ and the Virgin Birth as being untrue and no one could witness to you as being antichrist, but when in open opposition to Jesus the Christ as the Messiah and the Virgin Birth you are distinguishing yourself as antichrist.

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You said some have called you “Jesus like” and my response was “It is better to be hated for what you are then to be loved for what you are not.” I did not say you were hated for what you are. I was being fatuous regarding your comment.

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Your comment “Some of your material has been read by friends; they wonder if you are serious, as I am told that you are not a good example of one who they would look to, to represent their faith.” I suspect that this is a bold face lie and very transparent and even on the silly scale. But when you can’t hurt one with the truth you try and hurt them with lies.

Dear Jameslee;

You suppose, and the suppose is your truth. Why are you copying me as AC copies everyone? Why are you so concern as to how I state my answers to what other persons try to convince me of? Over the years, your type of comments have been part of the arsenal of those who were determined to convince me of their theology, and when I share with friends what has been told me, the reaction varies from a shrug and they are silly, to being told how unchristian they are. So it is with you, as you come across as a bully, not one who wants to have a discussion.

The theology Jesus is based on is what Judaism teaches,  and there, I am very pro-Jesus. I do not agree with everything he said, but why should I? We are two different individuals, from two different time periods.

The "Jesus" I do not agree with is the third century version, where your Church Fathers crucified the faith by changing it to the form it is now. I  learned this through my studies as I responded to questions discussions like ours brought up, or linked to my readings or conversations.

I have a great deal of empathy for the Christians who suffered by the hand of the newer churches, as they were declared heretics and suffered for it. I am happy to see millions of Christians, today, taking a close study of their history and returning to the truths of Jesus' teachings.

As for your complaints of what I say about virgin births and demigods/godsons? I am not chastising your faith, just relating what HaShem has to say to us, and why His Word to us, through His Prophets as well as the two comments He made directly to our nation at Sinai, makes it clear that your theology is not ours.

I would not have if I had not been attacked so often for being a Jew and the attacker calling G-d Satan, etc. You shared how you feel about being told, which I am not trying to tell you, about how I see Jesus, or your perception of same. Multiply this a couple of times, as my responses only provoked the evil one to more vile words against my faith.

Also, You getting upset by "implications" of mine, which you have failed to identify, and being "fatuous"? Sometimes a more correct response would help. You are going to say you have been clear; I say OK, we are both from the same generation, so there should have been little space in our understanding each other. But James, you have blinded yourself with your negativity about what I say.

I invite all to take a close look at the articles I post. You may not like what they say, but they are the truth of what G-d said, and this is what I have been successful in doing. I feel that, with the bigotry I have suffered on this blog, as well as the stiff nakedness of some in refusing honest conversation on our faiths, I am doing a holy work, here.

It is better to be hated for saying what G-d says, then loved for agreeing with what man believes.

Shalom;

Yechiel

Rocmike under its many aliases never uses facts. It makes things up and tries to pass them off as facts. It believes everyone is as stupid as it is and will believe them.

Attn: Yechiel

I don’t copy you as you say AC copies everyone. I quote you word for word when I do quote you, and then make my comment so all can see. I am only concerned with how you state your answers and comments when they imply that which is not there or true and are misleading and addressed to me and not what others try and convince you of, that is between you and them.

It’s like this, you state “Over the years, your type of comments have been part of the arsenal of those who were determined to convince me of their theology, and when I share with friends what has been told me, the reaction varies from a shrug and they are silly, to being told how unchristian they are.“ Like I have an arsenal and I am out to convince you of my theology, you imply it but it never happened. And it is the same with the rest of the above comment, you try to tie it to me and it never happened. But you regress, for what does any of this have to do with anything we have been posting about. Just another why to misdirect and vilify me.

I am defending my Lord and Savior and I am doing so very strongly in order to get my point across. As for having a discussion do we not first need to be on that common ground that you have mentioned? To discuss why Jehovah or Mosses is untrue or why Jesus the Christ and the Virgin Birth is untrue is not common ground. To discuss your positive views and my positive view regarding our faiths is.

Regarding your comment “The "Jesus" I do not agree with is the third century version, where your Church Fathers crucified the faith by changing it to the form it is now.” Jesus the Christ is Jesus the Christ, not Jesus the Christ of the third century or Jesus the Christ of yesterday or tomorrow. He is Jesus the Christ, yesterday, today, and always, He is the Word of God. As to your comment regarding the crucifixion of the Christian Faith to the form that it is now is way out of line. The Christian Faith is still being formed and will continue to be formed and always for the better, constantly being rediscovered. Out of curiosity, what did Jesus say that you do not agree with?

No you are not chastising the Christian Faith when you say that Jesus the Christ is not the Messiah or that the Virgin Birth is untrue, you are degrading the foundation of the Christian Faith. Also you are not relating what HaShem has to say to you and why His Word to you through His Prophets or what was directed to your nation at Sinai, you are giving your opinion and your spin on the Word of God. Give chapter and verse for others to look so they can decide for themselves.

The attacks on you for being a Jew and your Faith is one thing but demeaning the foundation of the Christian Faith is another. And let me be clear, when you try and prove that Jesus the Christ is not the Messiah and that the Virgin Birth is false, you are attacking and demeaning the Christian Faith. I have not attacked you for being a Jew or because of your beliefs; my reason for aggression is simple and has been made very comprehensible.

I am not blinded any negativity, I am seeing negativity and responding to it. I agree that all should read your post and determine for themselves as to it being what God said or you spin on what God said.

Nice to see you have taken my catch phrase and used it in another positive way. And wouldn’t it also be nice to say what God says without adding what man says?

Dear James;

Let us agree then that to Torah Centered and observant Jews, Christianity is not part of our thinking, except as for history. We have the Theology of the Tanach we go by, with the wisdom of our sages over the centuries, starting with Sinai. We live and believe according to what we read and learn from this.

As you know, the Christian leadership used a version of the Septuagint for much of their information, or just had the Torah as not part of their works. So we have developed different, as you put it, being formed. True, and i have read many articles and posts where Christians are taking a serious  look at the history, and we are finding more common ground.

What I post is what Believers believe, who are Jewish. There are veriations, as to Orthodox, Concervative, Reform, but any item one may have is to some degree shared by others, or historical on context. I post NOT my views, but the ideas and beliefs of the Jewish people in general, with the veriations understood. On the articles i have and shall post, read the verses, use one of our websites to find a Jewish Bible, learn Hebrew if you can, and then make up your own minds.

Remember, James; just because i do ot accept your view does not make me an adversary, so you do not have to one to me.

Shalom;

Yechiel

PS.

We are going round robin. Enough already, si.

Attn: Yechiel

Your last post sounds sincere with substance and reflects a great degree of understanding. And you are correct when you say different views do not make you an adversary. Takes more then just views to make one and adversary, it is the action taken regarding the views that causes one to express opposition, we can always express our views without being an antagonist.

Nothing wrong with humbling ourselves, our God saw it coming.

Dear Jameslee;

Thank you.

Shalom;

Yechiel

Dear Friends;

There was a discussion on what Jesus was, as for Jewish or not.

Here is one item from the Church that may help to give information for the study of the items and the relationship to history.

>>> Nostra Aetate confirmed that Christ, his mother and the apostles were Jews, and that the church had its origin in the Old Testament. It denied that the Jews may be held collectively responsible for Jesus Christ’s death, and decried all forms of hatred, including anti-Semitism. Citing the Letter of St. Paul to the Romans, Nostra Aetate called the Jews “most beloved” by God. These words seem commonsensical today, but they staged a revolution in Catholic teaching.<<<

Maybe this note from the Church may help in healing, as well.

Shalom;

Yechiel